New 20S
What's happening with the 20S? Been announced a while ago, but still no sign of when it will be available? I'm looking forward to upgrading from the SMH10, but when?
Any news?
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Peter, I couldn't use the manager with my 20S, either. Included that in a support request to Sena. He replied promptly and said that the DEvice Manager hasn't been released yet.. I thanked him and asked if they could create one with a graphical User's Interface (GUI) to make it easy to navigate and operate.
Seriously, if you're that disappointed in the 20S and only bought it for the FM radio feature, people are reading this stuff and would probably like to cancel their order and buy yours. I doubt FM radio is ever going to work like an FM radio with nice antenna. It would take a hardware change.
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Anyone have experience with using the 20s with the SR10? I connected mine as well as my iPhone. Plays music from iPhone just fine and radio communications from the SR10 put the music on hold as expected but when the SR10 goes back into standby the music does not come back on automatically and I have to manually hold the jog dial in for 2 sec to resume music. I previously had an SMH10 multipaired with the SR!0 and the music always automatically resumed after radio communications activity Tried re-pairing both to no avail. It certainly is a pain to manually turn the music back on after each time the SR10 sends a signal to the 20s. Any ideas here?
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@ Peter, I also ride with the 20s now for a couple of days and the radio is in my opinion very good.
i only have a couple of stations because the iphone app is not ready yet but i'm certainly not disappointed at all of the 20S
everything goes pretty fast and sound is very good.
intercom is good, phone conversations are very good, pairing goes fast radio works nice, the only thing not working on mine is the voice control/commands.0 -
@ Ken, William, Thnx for your comments. I'm convinced that the problems will get solved. it's only very frustrating to receive the 20S 8 months after the initial marketing campaign started to notice software is not available and "stuf" isn't working the way it was presented. My SMH10B was working perfect so i expected the 20S only to be better. And yes, the only reason for upgrading to the 20S is the addition of FM radio compared to the SMH10B. Everything else was working perfectly on the SMH10B (to my expectations) As i have had a couple of bikes with integrated FM radio, now i ride a R1200GS so no more integrated FM Radio, i miss the FM radio... :-( I hope the 20S will surprise me soon and will justify upgrading (above and beyond the FM radio expectations) :-) Peter 0 -
Hi Sena, I got my (dual) 20S yesterday. I'm not utterly dissappointed, but, let's say, hopefull for a VERY quick firmware-upgrade....
1] Cannot connect to Sena Devicemanager (Cannot open USB). Using Win7, no BT-devices in the vicinity.
2] Voice-commands don't work. When I say "Hello Sena" nothing happens. no error, nothing. When I doubletap the body I hear "Say a command", and the LED flashes green. But there is NOTHING I can say to get a response after that. No error, no cancel... after "Say a command" nothing happens anymore. Not even if I wait 15 minutes. The LED still flashes green, and the 20S won't do anything else. I need to turn it off and on for it to work again.
3] Cannot play music via the Garmin Zumo 590. This is extremely important to me. I can't stress this enough. I allways ride with my music on my ears (no radio, can't stand radio, although it's better than nothing). Furthermore I'm going on holyday in 2 weeks... I would really, no REALLY!!!! like the Zumo 590 and the 20S understanding each other by then... Bye the way, I'm going to Ireland, so I really hope you made it waterproof too !
On the positive side... sound is OK. FM Radio is fine. Installing was no biggy (in a Shoei Neotec). Design is ok. I have yet to try the intercom in the field but I expect that to go well.
Oh, and a suggestion: I use the wired boom-microphone. There is a little wire running from the clamp-unit to the boom. This feels extremely delicate, and is bound to break at some point. It is the piece of wire before it enters the helmet. Maybe you can come up with some kind of protection for it.
Thanks, Marc T
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Hi Sena, I got my (dual) 20S yesterday. I'm not utterly dissappointed, but, let's say, hopefull for a VERY quick firmware-upgrade....
1] Cannot connect to Sena Devicemanager (Cannot open USB). Using Win7, no BT-devices in the vicinity.
2] Voice-commands don't work. When I say "Hello Sena" nothing happens. no error, nothing. When I doubletap the body I hear "Say a command", and the LED flashes green. But there is NOTHING I can say to get a response after that. No error, no cancel... after "Say a command" nothing happens anymore. Not even if I wait 15 minutes. The LED still flashes green, and the 20S won't do anything else. I need to turn it off and on for it to work again.
3] Cannot play music via the Garmin Zumo 590. This is extremely important to me. I can't stress this enough. I allways ride with my music on my ears (no radio, can't stand radio, although it's better than nothing). Furthermore I'm going on holyday in 2 weeks... I would really, no REALLY!!!! like the Zumo 590 and the 20S understanding each other by then... Bye the way, I'm going to Ireland, so I really hope you made it waterproof too !
On the positive side... sound is OK. FM Radio is fine. Installing was no biggy (in a Shoei Neotec). Design is ok. I have yet to try the intercom in the field but I expect that to go well.
Oh, and a suggestion: I use the wired boom-microphone. There is a little wire running from the clamp-unit to the boom. This feels extremely delicate, and is bound to break at some point. It is the piece of wire before it enters the helmet. Maybe you can come up with some kind of protection for it.
Thanks, Marc T
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Dear Sena - Can you guys give us any idea as to when the 20S will be available to more than just a few people? You've got lots of frustrated customers and it'll be very helpful if you would get in touch with whoever is in charge of your shipping and have them explain the cause of the delays and why the waiting period keeps getting longer and longer. Thanks.
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Here's a tip:
When learning the Sena 20S with friends, don't be close to each other. My friend and I really were having trouble getting the functions to work (His SENA to Zumo, His Zumo to iPhone, etc.) I was trying to teach him what I've learned, but all kinds of strange things were happening. Sometimes, one of the SENA would go to Config, even though our hands were by our sides. And here's the big one. We were trying to prove that he could make and receive phone calls to my iPhone from his 20S. It would handle the call perfectly, but he couldn't hear any audio. We futzed with that for over an hour. Then, he got a phone call from someone else and it worked perfectly. He held the entire conversation with that other party with no problems. When he ended the call, I said, "do you know what just happened? You used the Sena to answer the call and talk/listen!" (We never got that to work when standing near each other). Apparently, close proximity of our two iPhones, Sena headsets, and Zumos were confusing the processes. We separated by 20 feet and tested; and everything worked just fine.
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The FM-radio on the 20S, does it have AF ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_frequency
Couldn't find this in the manual.
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@Marc, according to the productspecs it does have AF http://www.sena.com/product/intercoms/20s/#tab-specifications Have to say the FM radio is not working on my 20S. (Nearly not, very very very poor quality) Nor is the Sena manager on Imac, Win7 or Win8.1. Iphone app is not available (yet) but luckaly the android app is available. (And i happen to have a neighbour that has an android phone (Samsung) and was willing to "help" me. Via my dealer i received instructions to position the speakerwire "differently" (on the innerside of the helmet shell) The speakerwire seems to be the antenna for the FM radio. (Info from Sena) Have tried to dissasemble my BMW System 6 Evo but couldn't get the inner shells out. :-( (withoud running into the risk to distructively damage my helmet) With the speakercable (antenna) out of the helmet (free in air) i was able to "Test" the radio with best possible antenna positioning... Additional instructions received from Sena support (via my dealer) where to change the regional FM radio settings to "Australia" instead of "Europe" (where i happen to be situated), this should improve radio quality. Result: nothing better than the achieved results with the antenna in the helmet. (Tried all possible regional settings withoud any succes) I have personally filed a support request about my problems but this still needs to get assigned to a supportmember. I hope Sena will solve the problem quickly. Peter 0 -
Marc, Sena said that the Device Manager software is due out in 2 weeks. That was almost a week ago.
When I double-tap my 20S (and both of my friends' 20Ss as well), the Sena Lady says, "Say a command". If your volume is down, you may miss it. If you answer with, "What can I say?", the Sena Lady will come out with about a dozen voice commands that she'll recognize. It has worked perfectly on the 3 20Ss that I've installed (for myself and my friends).
I have a Garmin 650. Music, driving directions, MP3, Audio Books, etc . . . . . . they all work perfectly with my 20S and the other two 20Ss as well. Once paired, it connects when both are turned on. I can hear the Garmin beeps through the Sena as I press buttons on it. I go to Music Source and select the options on the Garmin. Whatever I have selected comes through nicely. Remember, each connected device has its own audio. So your audio may be turned up for one and way down for another. Once you set it for a connection or device, it stays there for that device unless changed.
I reported that the FM radio wasn't functioning on my 20S. Well, I was wrong. It's working; but reception range is reduced from a car radio reception; probably because of lack of a big whip antenna. I'll forego FM radio when riding where reception is poor (versus having a 3' long whip antenna on my helmet) (Just kidding!)
A lot of this stuff is (probably) just learning our way around the Sena. It'll still do a lot more stuff than I thought. For instance, I haven't played with the Ambient switch yet. Not exactly sure what that does. I discovered that there's a little cable that will connect the 20S to a non-Bluetooth device. That works perfectly on my Harley with it's non- Bluetooth radio. I can now listen to my Harley's AM, FM, CB, and WX radio.
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Thanks Peter B. In Holland the radio is adequate. My speaker-cable runs along the back of the helmet. Not the top. I'll test it further next thursday.
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@Ken: Thanks, but I know how the volume works (each source has it's own setting), and I know how the voice-commands should work. But they don't. I have a little suspicion though. Senna mentioned on facebook that there is a huge backlog on the 20S'. I suspect that they just shipped the unfinnished product so to satisfy as much customers as possible, releasing a firmware upgrade as soons as possible to finnish the product. I'm not sure weather to be happy about that or not. I was very anxious to get the Sena 20S, and now that I have it... I'm STILL very anxious to get the final product. I'm goiing on holyday in a week or so, and without my MP3's I'' probably die of boredom...
The ambient-function is a SUPER-DUPER-DELUX function, which I whished I had years ago. Sometimes you are in a situation that you're riding somewhere, your Garmin-chick is oozing directions in your ears, you listen to your MP3's...eeehr....the FM-radio, Maybe talking on the intercom to someone, and suddenly something happens in traffic that requires your full attention. You hear a police-sirene, but can't see where it's comming from. Someone is honking at you, a pedestrian is talking to you..... Something like that. At that time you would love to have a button that shut's up all your electrtonic devices, and opens up a microfone that picks up the environment. That's what the ambient-button does. Kudo's to Sena for that.0 -
That Ambient feature sounds perfect for when I ride up to a group and they begin talking to me before I can take my helmet off or earbuds out. Sounds very cool.
On the other topics, I (we) struggled at first with the 20S. But somehow, by the 3rd one I helped with; it just worked. In fact, I even went back and cleared all pairings and my original one worked, too. I was definitely getting over the learning curve. The volume being at minimum was my first stumbling block. That happened occasionally with my 10R headset when I changed from earbuds (after a trip) to headset speakers. Couldn't even tell when the 10R was ON or OFF with the headset turned down and the helmet on my head (unless looking in a mirror).
Still surprising that your voice commands don't work. That was the one thing that I tried first (after getting my volume adjusted) and it worked; on my Sena and the other two. When it works, you're gonna love it. When I say, "What can I say?" The Sena lady in my head spouts off about 30 seconds of things I can say. Have trouble remembering them to make my selection.
I'll have to read again about saying "Hello Sena". I've never tried that. Sounds like it should be more reliable that tapping my unit (and accidentally tapping an intercom off or on).
We're supposed to be able to connect to up to 8 people, I think. I don't know how I'm going to remember who's who. Too bad we can't give them a name (Mike, Sam, George, etc.) . Maybe that'll be in the iPHone app or the Device Manager.
Ken
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Hello,
I´d like to buy two devices (one S20 and one SMH10) to communicate. I know there´s a limitation of pairing a single device, but it´s not clear if it´s only for another vendor or if it´s also applicable for other models.
If I buy one 20S and one SMH10, they will pair both as sena devices and I´ll still be able to pair an additional communicator from another vendor or the SMH10 will pair as an alien and I won´t be able to use a device from another vendor?
If has anyone experienced it, please advise because it´ll determine what should I buy.
Thanks
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What I found with voice command is it needs to be in standby mode, ie - nothing playing and no intercoms active when you say "hello sena". It will respond with "say a command". You must use one of the commands listed in the manual. If not in standby, such as playing music, fm radio,intercom you have to double tap the body of the unit, not the jog dial to use voice commands. If you select configuration, voice command doesn't work until you take the unit out of configuration mode or it times out - about 15 sec.
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Wow! That works so well! I didn't even know it'd do that. Now, checking battery is a snap. "Hello, Sena" The Sena Lady says, "Say a command." "Check Battery". "Battery level is high."
Marc, it's too bad yours isn't hearing your voice. Maybe try one of the other microphones; it could be a defective mic.
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Edgar - you can pair multiple sena headsets. With the 20s up to nine total and with the SMH10 up to four. . I've used my SMH10 to pair with a U-clear and a Scala on two different occasions but I haven't yet tried it with my new 20s but the instructions are the same so I'm assuming it works. You can only pair one universal headset (say a scala) to one Sena but the Sena can group to other sena units. You can add an additional non-sena unit to another sena headset that is not universally paired yet and group them together through the other sena headset. So for example, if you had two sena headsets you could add one scala headset to one of the sena's, add a U-clear headset to the other sena , then pair both sena headsets together. Everyone can talk together. Detailed info on how to do that is on page 38.
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Ken; no, it's not the microphone either. The intercom workes fine. I got a mail from Sena saying that the upcomming patch will resolve the voice-command-issue. So it's definitely a (known) glitch in the 20S.
Well, that's fine but what's much worse: it seems that receiving media from the Zumo 590 will still take a while before it gets solved. I'll refrain from expressing my feelings about this.
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JFYI
The 20S has problem with the voice control - I have an ticket open with support at the moment which they have been able to replicate - my voice control no longer works in standby or in any mode - I have been told there will be a firmware upgrade coming out sometime this week to fix it.
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Well, I'm out of ideas. Apparently, you are quite knowledgeable on these things yourself. My thought that if mine works, they all will is flawed. Keep in touch as you work through these things. I think it helps us all.
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funny story.... i found an adroid phone in the house... last one left :') and i installed the sena app and connected it to the phone.
It's telling me that the sena 20s is on firmware 1.0 and i should upgrade the firmware to 1.1.... but i cant because the device manager doesnt work :') FAIL!
but at least i could enter my FM radio frequencies in a jiffy :) and the speed dail numebers :)
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New software manager and firmware upgrade 1.1 now on the website. Just updated mine - perfect! You don't have to turn on the 20s like you do with the SMH10, just plug it in.
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Make sure you enable motion sensor sensitivity after updating firmware in the device setting section otherwise the double tap on the body for voice command won't work. Setting on high seems to work most reliably.
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OhYeah! updated both my headsets and voice control works now :) btw.. i didnt setup the motion sensitivity but the double tapping still works like before. like a charm :D
i just got a lot happier with my 20s :D only thing missing is the ios app... because the android phone i found is SLOW!!!! ... it's a very old htc, you can harly call it a smart phone hehehe
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I'm really excited about this update. Will do it later this afternoon.
I founded and own (with a 50/50 partner) a software publishing company back in 1992. If our customers had to wait until everything was absolutely perfect and issue free, they'd still be waiting. We publish a new release when it's substantially complete and we can't produce any issues. Every time with a new release, someone will use it in a way we hadn't thought of and issues pop up.
I think that's where Sena is now with the 20S. I'm happy with mine and am confident that the firmware will get better and better as time goes on. Even now after only having been released a couple of weeks ago, I believe they're the best Bluetooth communications units for motorcyclists available.
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was hoping the music resume issue when connected to an SR10 would have been resolved with the 1.1 update, but alas, it wasn't. Hopefully later updates to either the SR10 or 20s will resolve this soon.
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OMG OMG OMG !!! Downloaded the new Devicemanager (just start the old one, it will let you auto-update). Then downloaded and installed the new 20S firmware (1.1) !
OMG ! Everything works as it should ! It's great ! I hope it wil hold up in daily use. I mean I hope the BT-connections will hold without stutter or interference, and the 20S proves to be sufficient waterproof and all that. But at least the voice-commands as wel as the Media-streaming from the Zumo 590 works. Yeeeey ! Great work Sena.
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Hope it does. I downloaded the device manager last night and have just looked. Looks like the same version as I downloaded and it would not detect my 20S. Will see what happens when I get home tonight. Just want the iPhone app to be released as well. Apples store sucks.
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I downloaded the ver. 2.0.4 of the Sena Bluetooth Device Manager (Mac) and was successful in updating to ver 1.1 of the Firmware for the 20S. The two programs do appear to be identical when you start them up. They do include a new specific set of instructions for the 20S, however. You leave the 20S units turned off to do the update. When you're done with the update, the program allows changes to the configuration of various settings, saving speed dial #'s and radio station presets.
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