6

20S Ambient feature

Ken

July 22, 2014 16:38

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What a great idea!  No longer will I need to remove my helmet and earbuds to pay tolls or go through other highway stops like Border Patrol.  

I only use my earbuds for high-speed long distance riding.  Never for around town.  With my previous Sena Bluetooth unit, if I needed to talk to a toll booth operator while on the Interstate, it required removing my helmet and pulling my earbuds.  I also require hearing aids, so communication with my naked ears isn't all that good, either.  

The Ambient feature will fix all that.  We had to stop several times for tolls, Border Patrol stops, National Park entrances, and quick gas stops while on the highway.  Pushing the Ambient button allowed me to communicate outside the helmet without removing it or the earbuds.  

There IS just one issue with the Ambient, though.  It very highly favors the lower bass frequencies.  Harley motors would almost completely overpower all voice communication.  At Grand Canyon, a thunderstorm was booming just as we reached the park entrance.  The sound of the thunder transmitted to my earbuds by Ambient was overwhelming; had to ask the park ranger to repeat several times.  Wind noise (even light breezes) sounded like jet engines.  

The Ambient feature will be perfect when they tailor the audio to more normal flat response or to communication audio tones.  

Ken

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53 comments

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  RBEmerson November 10, 2015 17:55

  I tried Ambient mode during a recent 2K mile trip. Pulling up at a gas pump, I tapped the button twice and heard the noise around me. But the mic's frequency response seems odd. Maybe it's the mic's placement (where is that, BTW??). Whatever it is, it just doesn't sound right. I didn't experience a preference for the bottom end, as reported above. There were all types of noises at the gas stops and they didn't overwhelm the system. It sounded a bit like listening to the sound through a cardboard tube. Odd...

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  Bill Henning March 12, 2016 17:03

  On one of my headsets the ambient mode had ceased working.  It was difficult to know this immediately because going into ambient mode doesn't give you any voice or beep confirmation.  I just started noticing that double push of the bottom button did not result in any improvement in my ability to hear outside sounds.  Since I use earbuds this is a somewhat important feature and just makes life easier when you have to talk to somebody without removing your helmet.

  So anyway I submitted a help ticket and got the usual canned response about resetting the unit.  I tried the pinhole reset and it didn't do anything.  Then I tried the factory reset and voila!  Ambient mode now works again!!  So if you are having this problem you can try the factory reset.  Unfortunately you have to re-enter all your speed dials and FM stations, so write them down before doing this.  There really should be a back up/restore function for that, but this isn't the right thread for that conversation.

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  Sena March 14, 2016 20:08

  @Bskjack3: It is correct that when activating the Ambient Mode on the 20S, it will interrupt the intercom due to it having a higher priority than the intercom. The issue you are describing may be related to the Sidetone feature on the headset. The Sidetone feature allows you to hear yourself when you are talking over the intercom. Make sure that this feature is disabled on both your headset and your second headset. Furthermore, adjust the location of the microphone as it may be picking up all of the noise outside of your helmet.

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  Liam April 13, 2016 21:35

  On my replacement unit double tapping on the button just increases static. The microphone seems to have stopped working. Worked fine on my first unit before it was replaced due to the radio not working.

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  Liam April 13, 2016 21:36

  On my replacement unit double tapping on the button just increases static. The microphone seems to have stopped working. Worked fine on my first unit before it was replaced due to the radio not working. Loved the SMH10 I had before but I have had nothing with grief with the 20S biggest waste of money I have ever purchased.

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  Liam April 17, 2016 04:05

  Bill tried your fix (Factory reset because your fault symptoms match mine, but unfortunately that didn't work for me)

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  RBEmerson April 17, 2016 13:37

  Bill Henning wrote: "[...T]ry the factory reset.  Unfortunately you have to re-enter all your speed dials and FM stations, so write them down before doing this.  There really should be a back up/restore function for that, but this isn't the right thread for that conversation."

  Think about using the 20S app to store this information.

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  Alex Rodenberg April 27, 2016 20:52

  Although its still pretty bad, for me the audio is louder if i unplug the microusb rubber plug in the main unit,
  At least i can hear people now, still gotta be super careful with touching the unit though or it will blow my eardrums.... Mic is definately somewhere inside the main unit
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  Simon Woodend July 15, 2016 23:11

  I've recently bought a 20s twin pack, and i'm having the same issue that Bskjack3 is having. the two units i have will NOT go into standby mode during intercom speech, apparently they should work on a VOX idea but, they stay permanently live. We can CONSTANTLY hear wind and engine noise, along with gear shifting, this all but drowns out any satnav/music, but worst of all, it is very tiring to have this constantly in your ears. We tried them on a 200 mile ride today, and after 40 minutes i had pulled over and shut the damn thing off!!! Does anyone know how to stop this, or at least get the VOX intercom to work so we only hear engine/wind noise when we are speaking?

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  Simon Woodend July 15, 2016 23:12

  I've recently bought a 20s twin pack, and i'm having the same issue that Bskjack3 is having. the two units i have will NOT go into standby mode during intercom speech, apparently they should work on a VOX idea but, they stay permanently live. We can CONSTANTLY hear wind and engine noise, along with gear shifting, this all but drowns out any satnav/music, but worst of all, it is very tiring to have this constantly in your ears. We tried them on a 200 mile ride today, and after 40 minutes i had pulled over and shut the damn thing off!!! Does anyone know how to stop this, or at least get the VOX intercom to work so we only hear engine/wind noise when we are speaking?

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  RBEmerson July 16, 2016 13:36

  Interesting... My 20S seems to have problems with the external mic, too. On previous trips, I double clicked the button and heard a ton of noise at each gas or toll stop. Now I think I haven't got it working. Now I know how to fix it.
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  Bill Henning July 18, 2016 00:32

  RBEmerson, is there a way to backup your speed dial and FM stations in the Sena phone app?  I can't see how this is done.  Please explain. Thank you.

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  RBEmerson July 18, 2016 12:27

  AFAIK, you can enter whatever FM stations in the app. When you do an update or whatever, that data should be showing up in the 20S. The same works, AFAIK, for speed dialing.

  Start the app and make sure it's got a working BT connection to the 20S. Tap the three bars icon in the upper left and the main screen should slide to the right, showing group settings, pairing list, basic settings (just came from there), speed dial, FM radio, and documentation. Tag the list you want to tinker with and you should be good to go. I think.

  Playing with Device Manage 3.1 on my PC, click on the More tab in the upper right corner of the manager window. It looks greyed out, but it'll give you access to speed dial and the radio.

  The truth is, Sena writes only basically usable tools. The scrolling in the Sena slides when it wants to. The Device Manager More button looks as though it's disabled when it isn't. All of this could be avoided by letting users beta test stuff and send feedback. Again, Sena's record of barely talking to its user base shows. up. Sad...

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  Bill Henning July 18, 2016 15:15

  Alex Rodenberg is right, the microphone used by the Ambient feature is in the body of the 20S.  Not the cradle but the 20S unit itself.  I did a little experiment and used a portable radio sound source to see if opening the USB rubber plug made a difference and it totally did.  With the plug in firmly I can't hear anything outside (I use in ear buds), but when I pull the plug off I can hear outside reasonably well, a big improvement.  Just have to remember to push the plug in when wet weather comes.

  RBEmerson, I am aware of the ability to enter stations in the Sena App, but if I do the factory reset it wipes them out and I have to manually re-enter. What I was hoping for was some way to save these to a backup file so they could be reloaded after the factory reset.  I suppose if I did a firmware restore it might do that but I'd rather not muck with the firmware update unless its really necessary.  My 20s's just went off warranty so I have to be careful...

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  RBEmerson July 18, 2016 17:31

  Sigh... I guess I understand the reasoning of putting the mic inside something that can be sealed (the USB port). But leaving the cover off allows Bad Things to happen to the USB port, while keeping the mic open/uncovered.  OTOH, if caught in a sudden rain, remembering to close the port while rolling might just not be priority 1.

  Well, dang, a reset does kill speed dialer and radio settings. I guess it's time to resort to paper and pencil memory devices.

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  Trevor Butler July 28, 2016 11:21

  Simon Woodend - Have you found a solution to the Intercom staying open? Have you logged a fault with Sena? We had the same issue on our trip to Spain a couple of weeks ago and no matter what we tried with different settings, different pairings etc we couldn't cure it. We have both logged faults with Sena and whilst my mate has yet to get an answer they have given me a warranty replacement, but I don't believe that is the answer as it seems too many people are getting this issue for it to be a faulty unit, more likely a design/software issue. We are getting together in a couple of weeks and will try again but we don't expect it to be sorted.

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  Bill Henning July 28, 2016 14:30

  Maybe you guys should open another thread discussion about the intercom staying open.  This one is about the Ambient feature which I am pretty sure is unrelated to that.

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  RBEmerson July 28, 2016 14:37

  Agreed. AFAIK the bulk of the ambient issues are sorted out. There is an awful lot of topic drift going on here.

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  Liam July 28, 2016 20:48

  I just got my 2nd replacement unit (so I am now on my third unit). The first unit had numerous problems including voice commands not working and radio dropping to complete static even when very close to the radio transmitting aerial.

  On the second unit the radio worked reasonably well (although no where near as good as reception as a good car radio or traditional portable transistor radio. However iit also developed a fault that rendered it useless. It would not stayeed paired with my phone for more than a few minutes and the ambient feature stopped working and the voice speed dial feature never worked.

  I suspected the failure of the  two units was probably caused in both cases by being caught in a light rain shower. Neither worked properly afterwards. The first two times my unit was replaced was under warranty but I fear next time my warranty will have expired. On the first occasion Sena paid the freight both ways. On the second unit Sena asked me to pay the freight to return the faulty one and also supply the replacement but after months of pointing out their warranty service was promoted as free of charge, they finally agreed to pay the freight one way.

  With the new (third) unit the phone pairing and ambient feature are working (Yay!) but the voice speed dialing is still not working properly and will only ever call 'speed dial 2' no matter what speed dial number I ask for as was also the case with the previous two. I think the voice command functions slightly better on this one than the last two as the other speed dial features work OK if I mimic a John Wayne accent and shout fairly loudly.

  I hope this one doesn't develop more faults that render it unusable. Fingers crossed and hoping.

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  RBEmerson November 23, 2016 02:59

  Many of the above ambient complaints sound like a common problem. The charging port cover is snapped into place (sounds like a very good idea in rain and dust). But that also covers the ambient mic. It's next to the charging port. IMHO Sena should have rethought this issue. For now, though, the fix, in most cases, it to leave the charge port cover open.  HTH

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  Kenny March 02, 2020 19:21

  Thank you RBEmerson! I've been searching the internet for this! Awful design by Sena. The mic is so awful under the charging port cover. I literally have to open the cover to hear anything outside using ambient mode.

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  Martin February 24, 2021 10:27

  Just found this, didn't hear anything in ambient mode with the Bose qc20. Thanks RBEmerson! Where is this microphone exactly? I watched some battery replacement videos. I'm no electronics expert but didn't see a mic. I expect it to be at the backside of the second print plate (the one with the shaft for the knob. If so then carefully drilling a hole in the backplate (facing the helmet) seems a more neat solution than rippping of the rubber plug, or let the wind decide in which position it ends up. Such hole could even take a noise filter from earplugs, and that would also protect it better against water coming in

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  RBEmerson February 28, 2021 05:23

  As best I can figure, the mic is back near the USB plug. Consider that an informed guess. 

  I doubt drilling a hole is going to be worth the effort. There isn't a lot of "safe" material to drill into. Easier to flip off the cover, and call it good.