Battery drains when unit is turned off
I have two sena 20s that both have the same problem. When the unit is fully charged and powered off, after a few days it will be dead. I never had this problem with the smh10.
Question: would it be OK to leave it plugged into a usb charger all the time? That way when I want to go riding i can just grab it. Otherwise I have to remember hours before I ride to charge it. Or I end up riding with a USB cable plugged into the unit on my helmet.
Has anyone else had this problem? I am using 1.3 firmware and serial number is 14100xxxx
Sena please let me know if it is OK to leave it plugged in all the time.
Other than that, it is an excellent headset.
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I have the same problem. I just contacted Sena regarding the issue. I am hoping to get the unit replaced.
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I've had the same problem with 4 different units. I got a dual pack (S/N 14XXXX units). I fully charged them and put them back in the box. Two weeks later, I turned them on and they both immediately said "low battery" and powered off. I never got a chance to verify this as I returned them to Sena for a number of issues. I received S/N 15XXXX replacement units. I fully charged the replacement units and put them back in the box on 4/25/15. I powered them up today (5/3/15, 8 days later) and they both immediately said "low battery" and powered off. This appears to be consistent behavior. So, unless they can somehow come up with a firmware fix for this, charging just before or during a ride appears to be the way to go.
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Good News! After updating to firmware 1.4 the battery no longer drains. I have 2 sena 20s on my desk that have been sitting for 5 days and they are still at a full charge. They would have been drained by now.
*** FIRMWARE 1.4 FIXED THIS ISSUE ***
If you have the same results, please post a comment and share your experience. If it didn't work for you, again, post it.
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Unfortunately, my current two units are running firmware version 1.4 and they still drained in a week (4/25/15 - 5/3/15) when powered off. I recharged them both on 5/3/15 and put them back in the box powered off. I took them out of the box and powered them up on 5/7/15 (4 days later). One said "battery level is medium" and the other said "battery level is high". A Sena engineer said that, if any buttons are pressed while powered off, it may drain the battery. I had stored them in the box exactly as they were shipped. The only thing that could have pressed any buttons is the documentation sitting on top of them pushing the jog dial. I can't imagine the docs pressing that hard on the jog dial, but I guess it's possible. I recharged the "medium" one, but not the high level one and left them on top of the box to avoid any button pressing. Today (8 days later) I checked the unit that reported a high battery level on 5/7/15 and it still says "battery level is high". I haven't checked the one that reported medium level on 5/7/15. I'm going to just let that one sit on top of the box untouched for the full 8 days and see what it reports on 5/15/15. If either of them completely drains by 5/15/15, I'll need another fix besides firmware version 1.4.
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Ok. Here's what I just reported to the Sena engineer:
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I just checked both of my 20S units and they are both reporting a high battery level. Here's the individual status:
XXXXXXX15: Unit charged on 5/7/15 and still reporting "battery level is high"/LED flashes 4 times on power up. This is after 7 days sitting on top of the box
XXXXXXX17: Unit charged on 5/3/15 and still reporting "battery level is high"/LED flashes 4 times on power up. This is after 11 days sitting on top of the box
At this point, the only thing I can think of that would cause the battery to originally drain within 8 days is the jog dial being pressed by the documentation in the box. I honestly don't believe the docs were pressing hard enough, but that (in the box vs on the box) is the only difference between the fast drain time and the latest test.
The only other possible causes that I can think of would be a false "full charge" blue LED indicator or incorrect battery level monitoring falsely detecting a low battery and shutting down. But, at this point, my units seem to be holding a charge while powered off. At least one for a week and the other for 11 days to date. I'll continue to monitor the battery level while on top of the box until I have to use the units, which will end the powered off battery test..
Please do continue the test on the units you mentioned and let me know the result.
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I should mention that, during the first 4 days (5/3 to 5/7) of the second powered off battery test, I stacked the boxes the units were stored in. This may explain why one was "medium" and one was still "high" after 4 days. The "medium" battery level unit *may* have been the one on the bottom, but I don't actually know that to have been the case. If it was, the box on top may have supplied enough pressure to push the jog dial. That doesn't explain why *both* units were dead in a week (4/25 to 5/3) during the first test though. Maybe I was just unlucky the first time and there was enough pressure in both boxes to press the jog dial. I'm not sure about anything at this point. In any case, I will NOT be storing the units in the box anymore and will continue to keep an eye on this.
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Just checked them again. Day 9: both show fully charged.
Mine used to drain when sitting on the desk with nothing attached. So in my case it wasn't an issue with the buttons being pushed. Mine would have been long dead by now on V1.3 firmware. not sure why it worked but i am thrilled. =)
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I have experienced mine drain twice since i owned it (141 serial) and with firmware 1.3 and 1.4
I think both times i let it charge overnight and more a day then put it back into helmet base for a week.When i plugged it back in to charge it charged rather quickly (1hour or so) then the blue light came on. I turned it on for a few secs and it went back to red for another 2 hours +. So there might be another bug there
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Just FYI, this is the response I got back from the Sena engineer:
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I am testing my unit after fully charged.
I used the 20S for several minutes sometimes and turn off from 1 week ago.
Now, the battery level is still high.++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hopefully my two units will behave from now on.
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I have a 20S serial number 150xxxxxx which was absolutely brilliant on a european tour two months ago (intercom, TomTom and iPhone music). HOWEVER - the battery will now drain if left untouched. I can't say for how long, but it shouldn't matter - a day, a week but not much longer.
If off, it should not drain. Rechargeable batteries will lose some charge, but drain completely? That's wrong. On my tour it was charged very night, so the issue didn't materialise until lately.
It is making an ad hoc ride impossible if I want to go with the 20S on - so I don't bother now. SENA - is this what you want people to be thinking of your product, and telling other people?
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Try storing them with a full battery. Mine seems to drain only when the battery is not fully charged. Let me know if that works for you too.
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It was fully charged (blue light), unplugged, switched off and left on a shelf with nothing touching it. Still it discharged. 0 -
Hello,
On another thread, I posted the following back in July:
====================================================================================================
Just an update to my powered off battery life. As of yesterday (7/12/15), the unit charged on 5/3/15 was still reporting "Battery level is medium" (3 flashes). The unit charged on 5/7/15 was reporting "Battery level is high" (4 flashes). So, the powered off battery life appears to be considerably better when sitting on top of the box vs. what it was when I stored them in the box where buttons could possibly have been pressed. I have no idea why the one unit went to medium after only a month and was still at medium after over two months, while the other remained at high for two full months.
Just a note. I used the unit charged on 5/7/15 during a 5 hour ride yesterday. My friend and I kept the intercom call up the entire time we were riding. The unit reported a high battery level when we started and was still reporting a high battery level when I got home. That's after 5 hours of talk time. Go figure.
I fully charged both units last night after updating to the latest firmware version (1.4.1). So, my little test is officially over.
July 13, 2015, 10:59 AM====================================================================================================The above was running firmware version 1.3. I'm now running version 1.5 and both of my units keep a battery level of high for longer than the 1 week my original units. Both of mine will last *at least* a month before dropping to medium battery level while powered off.0 -
Mine is 2.0 and as I said previously it sits on a shelf with nothing touching any buttons.
As it has happened three times I suspect this is a faulty unit - I'm hoping someone from Sena might actually comment!0 -
I think you might be mistaken about your 20S running firmware version 2.0. As far as I know, they are only up to version 1.5:
http://www.sena.com/category/firmware/firmware-20s/
As for Sena commenting on this, I don't think it's reasonable to expect Sena to read every comment in every thread on the forum. I suggest you open a support request via the following page:
http://support.sena.com/requests/new
Or call them directly at:
- US & Canada (844) 311-7362, (408) 709-7362
- M-F 8:00AM ~ 5:00PM (PST: Pacific Standard Time)
- Central & South America +1 (949) 273-8851, +1 (949) 812-9117
Europe & Africa +33 1 6053 5560
Asia +82 2 529 7024
India / Middle East / Southeast Asia +91 9533 953 952
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Phil,
As Keith has stated, please submit a ticket to out Technical Support department so that they will be able to assist you with warranty service.
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Re: 20s battery drain / battery decay when fully turned off
I have read all threads on this topic (especially Keith's), but have to report the same problem. I purchased the 20s dual pack on Aug 17, 2015 - about 6 weeks ago. Both units are running the latest firmware.
- On Tuesday morning of this week I fully charged the 20s and confirmed this by turning the unit on on, observing the 4 red flashes indicating a full charge, and turning the unit off.
- I then set the unit aside, ensuring that nothing touched the jog dial.
- Today I went for a ride, playing music using the bluetooth connection to my Android phone. After 20 minutes, the "low battery" warning sounded, and repeated every 60 seconds until the unit shut off with "good bye" about 1.5 hours after power up.
This is a horrible battery life for a unit that is completely turned off. I also have the SMH10 (which the 20s was supposed to replace) and never experienced this type of battery drain/decay before.
What is going on with these 20s models? Has anyone found a solution?
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There is no solution. Sena's response to me was "do a reset. If that doesn't work send it back for replacement under warranty "
Great if you buy it from your local shop but NOT great when you buy it online and the supplier is in Germany and can not interpret your emails.
It gets worse for me - mine is now only working in mono. If I shake my head I get s minute or two of stereo, but that's it...
Oh and Keith? STFU. I'm not interested in what you have to say.0 -
John,
If you haven't already, I'd contact Sena support. I doubt they will be able to provide any help short of asking you to send the unit to them to San Jose, Ca. for repair or exchange. The support techs I've worked with are understanding and VERY willing to exchange units (Note: The support techs didn't design, build or market the units. They just have to deal with the issues). It may be a crap shoot as to how the replacements perform, but it's worth a try.
I'm not sure what is going on with the batteries in the 20S units. My original two units lasted a week powered off. The replacement units did the same thing the *first* time I charged them and let them sit. However, they both seem to be holding up well when powered off now.They easily last at least a month and still report a high battery level. I *thought* the issue may be buttons being pushed, but if you and others are experiencing powered off battery drain out of the box, there's obviously something going on with the units. Since my replacement units experienced the powered off battery drain the first time I charged them, but not with subsequent recharges, I'm suspecting there is an issue with the charging cycle and/or battery level monitoring.
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Thanks Phil and Keith for your comments. I am running more tests, but I am suspecting that the units do not turn off completely - which causes the battery drain. Something is still active even after pressing the phone and radial button to turn the unit off.
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The mystery continues....
Today, after 12 (!) days of letting my 20S sit fully charged, unused, I went for a ride. At ride start the unit still showed 4 red flashes (fully charged), and for about 2 hours of playing music the unit performed without a hitch. At the end of the ride the unit again showed 4 red flashes. I didn't reset the unit, or uploaded new firmware, or change any settings.
Weird...
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Hi John,
That's pretty much the inconsistency I experienced with my replacement units. I can't see a battery sometimes holding a charge, but other times not. I think there's an issue with the charging cycle/battery level monitoring (it thinks it's fully charged when it's actually not). Either that or, as you said, something is still active even after pressing the phone and radial button to turn the unit off. If it's not the battery itself, I think that's good news as the battery isn't user replaceable. However, they may be able to provide a firmware fix for a charging cycle/battery level monitoring problem or leaving things active on power down.
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Agreed - it seems to be a software issue, and not a problem with the battery hardware.
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List of potential software bugs. These are the ones that come to mind immediately, but there might be others:
- some software routine is still running and thus draining the battery, even after the unit is shut down
- the routine that shuts down the unit completely has a bug and indicates the unit is "off" when it is indeed still "on"
- the routine that indicates a fully charged battery is faulty and indicates a full charge when the unit is only partially charged
- the software that processes battery charging is faulty and only provides a partial charge
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And here are the results of the next round of testing:
- On Oct 25, in the p.m. after a full day of riding, I updated the OS 1.5.
- After updating the OS the unit was charged fully, overnight.
- On Oct 26 in the a.m. the unit showed 4 red flashes (fully charged). It was then turned off and set aside.
- Today, Oct 31 (after only 5 full days of sitting on the shelf) the battery was half empty (only 2 red flashes).
Again, the unit discharged on its own while completely turned off. Is there still no fix for this? Is anyone at Sena reading this / working on this issue?
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New test results:
- Nov 08: Fully charged overnight.
- Nov 09 thru Nov 20: I am testing the unit every other day by turning it on and then off. The unit remains fully charged: 4 red LEDs for every test. Happy!
- Nov 20, 8:30pm: The unit still shows fully charged after 11 days! But because I have a long ride the next day I re-charge the unit "just to be safe". After about 15 minutes the orange charging light changes to blue. Turning on/off confirms 4 red LED flashes.
- Nov 21: 9:30am: I am turning the unit on, and it shows only 2 red LED flashes. The unit is half empty. WTF????
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It appears that everything was fine until you subjected it to the charging process. I'm becoming increasingly convinced that there's a problem with the charging and/or battery level sensing functions on the 20S. Not completely turning off or batteries that *sometimes* hold a charge doesn't seem plausible to me. If the battery level sensing function is buggy, all of the battery level indications you mentioned above are suspect.
For what it's worth, I fully recharged both of my units on 10/21/15. I just checked them and both are still giving 4 flashes on power up. So, if my battery level indications are accurate, both are still at least 70% charged (4 flashes = 70%-100%) after a month.
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Keith, to test if the battery level sensing feature is working properly would it be possible for you to "use" your unit (which still shows 4 flashes after 1 month of non-use)? Maybe connect it to your helmet, switch it on, and monitor how many hours the unit runs before auto-shutting down? Only if it's not too much of an inconvenience for you. Because if your unit works for the n-hours that a 70-100% charge is supposed to last then we can at least confirm that the red flashes indicator is accurate.
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PS: I went to the Long Beach motorcycle show today and spoke with Chris W. at the Sena booth about this problem, and his recommendation was to send the unit in for a warranty replacement. While that's an option of course it's the last resort because a) if this is a software issue a replacement won't help, and b) the turnaround time to get the replacement is 2 weeks, he told me. That's two weeks without a communicator....great....
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And one final update for today: I just got back from the motorcycle show, and plugged the completely empty 20S into my PC for charging. After about 15 (?) minutes the charge port LED went from red to blue.
Now we all know that CANNOT be right because per the Sena handbook: "The LED turns red while the headset is charging and turns blue when it is fully charged. It takes about 2.5 hours to be completely charged." Something is very wrong here...
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After charging an empty 20S for about 15 minutes (the time it took for the charging LED to switch from red to blue and giving 4 red flashes indicating a full charge) the Sena played music (BT connection to the phone) for about 47 minutes before auto-shutting down.
I believe this confirms that there is a problem with the charge status indicator function. The charge status says "full" (4 red flashes), but that is not true.
Further, there seems to be a problem with the charging LED function that switches from red to blue after only 15 minutes, which cannot be true if charging an empty unit takes a full 2.5 hrs.
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